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Black_sheep
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Bayern, Germany
Joined: December 11, 2009
KitMaker: 674 posts
Model Shipwrights: 457 posts
Posted: Saturday, September 07, 2019 - 07:23 PM UTC
Hey Captains, there is currently just one single Campaign here at modelshipwrights running, drydocked 2019, but I have no ship drydocked.

Looking over to the armored or aircraft branch there are quite a lot different campaigns running. Wouldn`t it be fun to start a new thread here soon? No idea if we had similar operations before but I already would have three ideas for it:

1) Below 1.000 tons - simple as the title says all ships below that size are allowed. This should be no Problem for the builders as there is a huge choice of ships to build: corvettes, escorts, trawlers, LCTs, cutters, tugs, minehunters/minelayers, gunboats/torpedoboats, patrolvessels etc. etc.

2) Ships with a story - some ships have a very interesting story to tell; These ships, together with their own tale are allowed

3) In current service - all kind of ships and vessels which are presently in use


What do you all think?

Best Regards

Thomas
PasiAhopelto
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Uusimaa, Finland
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 366 posts
Model Shipwrights: 7 posts
Posted: Saturday, September 07, 2019 - 11:11 PM UTC
Fresh naval campaign sounds good. Would join, and hopefully complete a boat or ship build.

For the Below 1000 tons I have 80' Elco PT boat, and for the Ship with story there's HMS Campbeltown (St Nazaire raid). Unfortunately I don't have any modern ship models in stash. So "yes" for two first, and "possibly yes" for third topic.
md72
#439
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Washington, United States
Joined: November 05, 2005
KitMaker: 4,496 posts
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Posted: Sunday, September 08, 2019 - 04:33 AM UTC
Hey guys, I'm doing a similar thread on Aeroscale Campaign Ideas. One of the ideas was Navy planes, anything that landed on a carrier, any nation. Would there be a crossover opportunity? Planes and the Carriers they flew off of?
McRunty
#491
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Missouri, United States
Joined: April 06, 2016
KitMaker: 347 posts
Model Shipwrights: 165 posts
Posted: Monday, September 09, 2019 - 05:39 AM UTC
I would be down for any of these. I have kits which would fulfill all 3 suggestions.

I am participating in the dry docked campaign but I know I wont finish it. My USS Missouri is on a serious back burner for now so anything to get the juices flowing would be welcome.
GaryKato
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California, United States
Joined: December 06, 2004
KitMaker: 3,579 posts
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Posted: Monday, September 09, 2019 - 08:04 PM UTC
How about picking as body of water and all ships that sailed it, like the English Channel, the Mediterranean, etc.? Can cover military, civilian, sail, props, subs.
RedDuster
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England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 6,506 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, September 10, 2019 - 05:28 AM UTC
Some good ideas Thomas,

I like the "Below 1,000 tons", particularly with very limited workspace.

Also like the "ship with a story too"

Cheers

Si
d6mst0
#453
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Texas, United States
Joined: August 28, 2016
KitMaker: 1,490 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, September 10, 2019 - 06:51 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Some good ideas Thomas,

I like the "Below 1,000 tons", particularly with very limited workspace.

Also like the "ship with a story too"

Cheers

Si



I agree with Si, under 1000 tons works for me.

Mark
SpurnWater71
#504
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Florida, United States
Joined: July 06, 2019
KitMaker: 76 posts
Model Shipwrights: 73 posts
Posted: Tuesday, September 10, 2019 - 12:55 PM UTC
Is a good idea. However if you might consider a liberal interpretation of the 1000 ton limit:

- Flower Class Corvette: 1070 tons
- Castle Class Corvette: 1077 tons
- Hunt Class DE: 1020 tons
- Algerine Class minesweepers: 1030 tons
- etc.

I view all the above as being small ships
McRunty
#491
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Missouri, United States
Joined: April 06, 2016
KitMaker: 347 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, September 11, 2019 - 06:51 AM UTC
I had a few ideas.

Tale of two oceans: Vessels which fought in 2 oceans (not seas) so Prince of Wales would apply but not Bismarck

Sunken Sailors: Ships which were sunk in service. (not scrapped or sunk once decommissioned)

Armed Non-combatants: Ships which were not designed to be warships but had guns strapped on later. I am thinking Merchantmen with a single pop-gun, armed trawlers, converted merchant raiders etc
Black_sheep
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Bayern, Germany
Joined: December 11, 2009
KitMaker: 674 posts
Model Shipwrights: 457 posts
Posted: Wednesday, September 11, 2019 - 07:06 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I had a few ideas.

Tale of two oceans: Vessels which fought in 2 oceans (not seas) so Prince of Wales would apply but not Bismarck

Sunken Sailors: Ships which were sunk in service. (not scrapped or sunk once decommissioned)

Armed Non-combatants: Ships which were not designed to be warships but had guns strapped on later. I am thinking Merchantmen with a single pop-gun, armed trawlers, converted merchant raiders etc



Whow so much good ideas - a lot food for future campaigns :-)--
Removed by original poster on 09/11/19 - 19:08:02 (GMT).
Black_sheep
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Bayern, Germany
Joined: December 11, 2009
KitMaker: 674 posts
Model Shipwrights: 457 posts
Posted: Wednesday, September 11, 2019 - 07:14 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Is a good idea. However if you might consider a liberal interpretation of the 1000 ton limit:

- Flower Class Corvette: 1070 tons
- Castle Class Corvette: 1077 tons
- Hunt Class DE: 1020 tons
- Algerine Class minesweepers: 1030 tons
- etc.

I view all the above as being small ships



Hi Cypryan,

I don´t mind if we would call the Campaign also "Below 1.100 tons". I have quite some small ships matching this size.

If you gentlemen agree, one able member/moderator would establish this Campaign for the next future? (Regrettably I have no idea how to do this

Cheers
SpurnWater71
#504
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Florida, United States
Joined: July 06, 2019
KitMaker: 76 posts
Model Shipwrights: 73 posts
Posted: Thursday, September 12, 2019 - 12:34 PM UTC
Can one do "mini campaigns" under the general and broad campaign heading of "~1000T"?

It occurred to me that we might have more participation going on in parallel if we had mini-campaigns for gun and torpedo craft, escorts (sloops, corvettes, frigates), mine warfare (sweepers and layers), and working ships (tugs, netlayers, etc.) and perhaps amphibious craft?

I know it is a somewhat outside the box idea but am curious to hear what everyone thinks.

Kip
d6mst0
#453
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Texas, United States
Joined: August 28, 2016
KitMaker: 1,490 posts
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Posted: Thursday, September 12, 2019 - 11:18 PM UTC
I like that idea.

Mark
Quincannon
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Colorado, United States
Joined: June 22, 2018
KitMaker: 221 posts
Model Shipwrights: 221 posts
Posted: Friday, September 13, 2019 - 03:46 AM UTC
I have given this some thought over the last couple of days, and have concluded that if you want to do a campaign thread, why not do a campaign. Most sea battles were relatively short in duration, but there is one that ranges from May of 1942 to February 1943 - Guadalcanal.

The first strike at Tulagi was launched as a prelude to the Coral Sea, and the Japanese did not evacuate Guadalcanal until the following February. Nearly every well known ship in the USN, RAN, and IJN participated in the campaign at one time or another, and there were seven major confrontations during the period in question.

When is the last time you saw models of the APD's Little, Gregory, Calhoun, and McKean, all small boys that played a key role, or of Jamestown, the PT Boat tender that did so much vital repair work, many times under direct fire in Tulagi harbor.

Then there are the big guys,and their valiant little brothers, Canberra, Chicago, Boise, Cushing, Porter, and so many more on both sides.

Just a thought before my first cup of coffee.
d6mst0
#453
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Texas, United States
Joined: August 28, 2016
KitMaker: 1,490 posts
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Posted: Friday, September 13, 2019 - 05:03 AM UTC
Chuck,

That is a wonderful idea. It should would allow a wide range of ships to choose from.

Mark
Quincannon
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Colorado, United States
Joined: June 22, 2018
KitMaker: 221 posts
Model Shipwrights: 221 posts
Posted: Friday, September 13, 2019 - 07:07 AM UTC
Mark: I am a retired Army officer and throughout my career and then retirement I have had an interest in military history, but an interest tailored to learning its lessons. My special areas of interest are in no particular order

The Battle of the Bulge

The first year of the war in the Pacific, a time when the odds were close to even

The Little Big Horn Campaign as a study guide on what not to do

The Korean War, what I consider our first modern conflict, one where you stayed within your lane, to avoid world wide conflagration

And you will be pleased to know I am sure my interest in the Alamo and the Texas Revolution.

You don't learn anything about making war if you have overwhelming superiority of forces, and that is why I have probably chosen to have an in depth interest in these five.

The Guadalcanal Campaign is where the USN learned to fight, the IJN was cured of victory disease, we learned to work closely with our Allies, particularly Australia, and the United States Marine Corps came of age.

So many shipbuilding possibilities it boggles the mind.
d6mst0
#453
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Texas, United States
Joined: August 28, 2016
KitMaker: 1,490 posts
Model Shipwrights: 907 posts
Posted: Friday, September 13, 2019 - 07:25 AM UTC
Chuck,

I did only one enlistment in the Air Force in the 70's. I spend twenty four years with a major telecommunications company before working as contractor for the Air Force at Joint Base San Antonio.

Military history is my major interest and hobby. Battles both major and minor of WWI and WWII is my main focus. So when I saw your post the first thought i had was 'I should have suggested that idea'. You are so right about Guadagcanal and how Navy and Army learned to fight. It was the start of the war of attrition that the Japanese feared and wanted to avoid. The victory fever that they suffered from at the start of the battle of Midway still hadn't broken.

Mark
SpurnWater71
#504
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Florida, United States
Joined: July 06, 2019
KitMaker: 76 posts
Model Shipwrights: 73 posts
Posted: Friday, September 13, 2019 - 08:41 AM UTC
Another ~1000T mini-campaign possibility: "I'm a Ship so small they only gave me a number".

Spans PTs, PGs, PCs, SCs, and a large collection of yard, aux, and mine warefare craft. Lots of historical campaign possibilities.

Gives me motivation to get going on my L'Arsenal SC and PC
Quincannon
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Colorado, United States
Joined: June 22, 2018
KitMaker: 221 posts
Model Shipwrights: 221 posts
Posted: Friday, September 13, 2019 - 09:27 AM UTC
Mark: My son in law was a Joint Base San Antonio (actually Fort Sam Houston)for six years. They lived in Stonewall Bend just off the I-10. They are in Hanover County, Virginia now, He is at the Pentagon.

I like this campaign idea more and more, especially as I have most of the ships in my collection from that era.
md72
#439
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Washington, United States
Joined: November 05, 2005
KitMaker: 4,496 posts
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Posted: Friday, September 13, 2019 - 10:23 AM UTC
Chuck, just for kicks and giggles, there was a Guadalcanal Campaign way back in '16. It might have gone cross sites and had planes and armor.
Not that I ever finished my entry (P-400 Aeracobra), but it was a great campaign with lots of posts. Another one like that would be fun.
Quincannon
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Colorado, United States
Joined: June 22, 2018
KitMaker: 221 posts
Model Shipwrights: 221 posts
Posted: Friday, September 13, 2019 - 03:00 PM UTC
Before my time here I'm afraid, but now that I am here I just love this site.

P400's the export version of the P39. At Guadalcanal they belonged to the 67th Fighter Squadron under command of Captain Dale Bannon. I looked up the Lineage and Honors of the 67th the other day. It is still an active squadron in the USAF, but the "official" L & H Statement gives them no credit for Guadalcanal and being part of the Cactus Air Force. I have not yet discovered the reason, and perhaps it is because there was only a detachment of the squadron there. I'm still working on it. The Air Force has some strange lineage and honor rules.

I remember as a kid being so excited in seeing, then purchasing the Revell P39. Great kit for its day. The doors opened and everything. Great fun.
Littorio
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England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: September 15, 2004
KitMaker: 4,646 posts
Model Shipwrights: 1,070 posts
Posted: Friday, September 13, 2019 - 03:07 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Is a good idea. However if you might consider a liberal interpretation of the 1000 ton limit:

- Flower Class Corvette: 1070 tons
- Castle Class Corvette: 1077 tons
- Hunt Class DE: 1020 tons
- Algerine Class minesweepers: 1030 tons
- etc.

I view all the above as being small ships



Guy's haven't been around here for a while and was looking at this and thought of the many tugs that saw service until I found that the US Ocean going tugs weigh in at 1,500 ton full load and I would consider those to be 'small'. Same thought with the AVP small seaplane tenders (small is their official description) which tip the scales at over 2800 ton full load or 1766 ton light, but then they are carrying 30,000 gallon of aviation spirit plus all the spare parts to keep a patrol wing airborne and fed.

Note
Flower class, 1160 ton full load
Castle class, 1540 - 1630 ton full load
Hunt Type I, 1340 ton full load
Hunt Type II, 1430 ton full load
Hunt Type III, 1435 ton full load
Hunt Type IV, 1561 ton full load
Algerine class, 1125 - 1325 ton full load

So the question is do we go light load or deep/full load. As can be seen above even the lightest Flower class is over at full load. Sorry to throw the small spanner in the works as I would like to join a 'Small' build.
SpurnWater71
#504
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Florida, United States
Joined: July 06, 2019
KitMaker: 76 posts
Model Shipwrights: 73 posts
Posted: Saturday, September 14, 2019 - 03:14 AM UTC
Suggest using standard load for WWII campaigns. That's what I used in my post you quoted. The "Pro" to using standard is that it was a well-defined measure established by international treaty (Washington Naval Treaty). "Con" to using standard displacement is that many nations didn't strictly comply - some by intent, others by accident (poor estimation during design and loose controls during construction) and by need (lead ballast for stability-impaired ships)

I favor this because for small ships of the ~1000T category this campaign thread started with the standard displacement was generally fairly close to actual displacement.

Perhaps there would be interest in another campaign focused on "working boats", tonnage not constrained - this would pick up the tugs (Imagine a CripDiv1/BaitDiv1 USS Pawnee and USS Munsee towing USS Houston and USS Canberra) and the seaplane tenders, APDs, minelayers and minesweepers (including DMS & DM)

Kip
SpurnWater71
#504
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Florida, United States
Joined: July 06, 2019
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Posted: Saturday, September 14, 2019 - 03:25 AM UTC
How about a WWII Central Mediterranean campaign?

Action was prolonged and sustained with many battles to choose from. Further, there were many small ships involved: Regia Marina Corvettes, Torpedo Boats, motor gun (MAS) and torpedo boats in particular for the convoy escort scenarios. RN corvettes and USN PCE, SC, PC, PT, etc., for anti-submarine.

A good reference: "Warship Losses of World War Two," David Brown, Naval Institute Press (Maybe out of print?). It not only chronologically lists the actual losses but provides amplifying details about other ships involved in the loss.